[djwakelee]

Yes.  Just install the app on the multiple devices, and use the same account username and password.

[djwakelee]

@Trebacz: Combining two balanced 240V circuits can be achieved 2 different ways by physical clamp setup/hookup.  If you can fit both wires through the 50A CT clamp, you can do that and both circuits will be summed into one channel.   Both wires have to be on the same phase (same hot leg for each circuit) – otherwise they subtract which is not what you want.  If you can’t fit both wires in the the CT, you can purchase their larger 50A CT which will likely work.  Finally, if the wires are far away, you can get a 2.5mm Y adapter cable (audio mono), and combine the two CTs before connecting to the single Vue 2 channel.  You can only do any of these things for balanced 240V circuits – loads which don’t make use of a neutral (like you mentioned).

I do this with my solar production, which is monitoring two different 240V systems (string inverter and microinverters), using the two wires inside a single CT method.  You can do the same thing if you want to combine 120V circuits, which I also do (out of channels – even with two Vue 2’s).  Same story there – the two 120V circuits must be on the same phase.

Hope that helps.

• This reply was modified 3 years, 5 months ago by djwakelee.
• This reply was modified 3 years, 5 months ago by djwakelee.

[djwakelee]

In the 2.5 version of the app, they added the ability to see the current (amps) separately on each of the phases.  You will see this under the Mains, and this is only shown in Amps view.  It seems at the same time they did this, the percentage is now blanked.  The balance total is also missing.  All this seems like a bug as it didn’t used to do this – something appears broken.

[djwakelee]

Yes, for the math to work correctly, you’d need a 2nd Vue2 for the sub-panel and sub-panel circuits.  Then you can nest the subpanel Vue2 under the main panel in the latest app.  It sounds like you only need the kit with the Vue2 and the mains clamps, and you can move your all your 50A subpanel clamps to the 2nd Vue2.  In the process you’ll end up with 2 spare 50A clamps since you’ll now monitor the subpanel feed with the 200A clamps of the 2nd Vue2.

• This reply was modified 3 years, 5 months ago by djwakelee.

[djwakelee]

Amps shouldn’t be doubled in that case for that circuit (with the single clamp for 240V on the one leg).  The current flowing through the 240V circuit is the same whether you have 1 clamps, 2 clamps, or x clamps – on any of the legs.  What is different about using 1 clamp on 1 leg is that the voltage is 240V, versus 120V for any of the normal split phase circuits.

What they really need to do is allow you to indicate which ports are being used for 240V circuit measurement, and the type (single or dual leg clamp).  If setup for single leg, amps is amps, and power is obtained by multiplying the measured amps by the phase 1 voltage + phase 2 voltage.  If using two clamps (such as an unbalanced subpanel feed), allow the visual list to sum up the total power.  Better support for 240V circuits has been promised in a future app update.

So I think it is correct to not apply the multiplier to the amps (current).  Do they have an issue with the amps total and balance, that is likely.

[djwakelee]

Believe this is correct operation at this time, and a fix to an existing bug where Amps were being multiplied.  With the latest app it appears that the multiplier currently applies to volts on the circuit.  There isn’t a separate multiplier field for volts and amps, so they picked one (useful for using 1 clamp on 240V circuits).  In that case, as volts are doubled, power is also doubled appropriately.  This provides a valid workaround until proper app support for single clamp 240V is rolled out, as well as dual clamp combined summing.

Multipliers for amps would be useful to calibrate the CT’s, or if using the Vue with alternate CT’s with different ratio.  Probably not a supported scenario.

Believe older app versions behaved differently, where amps/volts/watts were all multiplied.

[djwakelee]

Agree this would be nice, and I also have a similar setup where main breaker is turned off and generator back-feed for power outages (interlock).  Unfortunately the Vue2 can’t tell you when the grid is back if it is isolated by the main breaker being off – no current flows through the mains sense clamps.

The way automatic transfer switches determine grid up/down is by having an uninterrupted voltage sense connection to the grid, or an electric field sense device.  We don’t have either of those methods available with the Vue2 hardware and accessories.  Nice idea for a future enhancement though.

[djwakelee]

Summing the two phases is one of the most wanted features (myself also), and yes they state it is planned for a future update (was Spring 2021, now stated to be Summer).  They just did a small update which added nesting of subpanel Vue’s (and other features), so they are actively adding in new things.  Of course, we’d all like it a bit faster, but it is on the list of upcoming new features.

Understand that many 240V loads will be balanced.  A typical 3 ton AC unit, pumps, hot water tank, EV chargers – anything which doesn’t have a neutral wire going to the load will fall into this case.  In those cases, only 1 clamp is needed and nothing is gained with 2 clamps.  However, what makes the present measurement workaround with 1 clamp somewhat inaccurate is that you specify a multiplier of 2x in the app to make this work.  But, if your voltage on each leg is not the same, this is where the small inaccuracy creeps in for the power.  Small error, but possible.  What they really need to do is add the phase 1 and phase 2 voltages, and then multiply by the current.  Hopefully when they add proper support for single clamp 240V they will do this, and then the 2nd phase monitoring is only needed for unbalanced loads or subpanel feeds.

[djwakelee]

As mentioned, according to Emporia, it is not possible to use the 200A sensors on the device ports – even with an adapter.   In that scenario, what they want you to do is use a 2nd and 3rd Vue for each of your subpanels.  In which case you can use the 200A sensors on the incoming mains at the subpanels, connected to the respective 2nd and 3rd Vue 2’s in each subpanel.  Depending if you want to also monitor the circuits within each subpanel, you can purchase the combo with only the 200A sensors and Vue 2’s, or with some 50A clamps also if you need them.

• This reply was modified 3 years, 5 months ago by djwakelee.

[djwakelee]

If your subpanels aren’t drawing the max 80A or 90A of the breakers, you can use the special large diameter 50A clamps to monitor those circuits.  They will fit larger gauge wire, such as you likely have for your 80A and 90A feeds.  But check the measurement specs to confirm – worked no problem for me with a 70A subpanel and 4 AWG wire.  The advantage of these clamps is that they are a little smaller than the 200A clamps, and supported by the Vue 2 in the device port (supposedly the 200A clamps are not).

50A Large Diameter Current Sensor

If you want to monitor your 200A Siemens main panel but the 200A sensors are too small, there is this option that will probably fit around both your conductors…

Pair of 200A Flexible Current Sensors for Gen 2 Vue

… but you’d need a shutoff before that panel to be able to install the sensors.  As Emporia mentions, those are best done by an electrician since the main feed wires have to be momentarily disconnected.

[djwakelee]

Yes, email.  I believe if you have that notification enabled in the software, then you should have got an email about the new release.  They haven’t updated the ‘what’s new’ in this forum in a long time.

[djwakelee]

This is how Emporia describes it…

“Custom Circuit Sorting on the Home Screen
If you aren’t a fan of how the Home Screen sorts your circuits by real-time usage, we’ve added the ability for you to create your own custom sort order, so your circuits will always be where you expect them. To take advantage of this feature, go to Manage Devices > Vue and Circuits and turn on Custom sort circuits on Home Screen. Once enabled, you’ll be able to tap and drag the circuits into whatever order your heart desires, which will be reflected on the Home Screen.”

[djwakelee]

If you enable custom sorting, you can then drag the circuits around on the home screen to layout the device view as you like.  It will then no longer auto-sort based on value – circuits remain fixed in place on the screen.

For me, with circuits with light loads (<10W), those devices jump around on the screen as it flips from 0 to > 5W due to some sort of sampling noise of the Vue 2 (Vue 2 zero’s out anything less than 5W).  If you enable custom sorting, they at least don’t jump around.  But I like your idea of being able to not display them at all if below a threshold – seems like a nice option to add.

 

[djwakelee]

I agree, it seem like a default until sync up.  But it also resorts to this after sync up, and flips back and forth between real and fiction with a bad connection.

[djwakelee]

What you described will work fine as of the new 2.5 app update.  That lets you nest the Vue2 devices, so the accounting will be correct.  The only issue right now is that visually the devices furthest in the chain will be hard to read as the app indents each Vue and associated devices when nested.  You need short named devices or they will be cut off – bad enough with one, likely much worst with a chain of 4.  Hopefully they do something better visually moving forward (2.5 app with nesting is bran new).

For proper accounting, I do believe you will need to use the 200A CTs on your subpanel feeds also.  You didn’t mention that in your ‘parts list’ of things to buy, but they seem to use that when calculating the balance totals for the full system – instead of summing up the nested loads/devices.  At least that is what it appeared for me, as I have a 2nd Vue without the 200 CTs, and the totals didn’t work right.  By using the 200A CTs on each sub panel, you’ll also get a nice tally for the consumption downstream of your daisy chain.

I’d maybe suggest you try this with 2 Vue’s first and see how you like the new nesting feature, before getting all 4.

• This reply was modified 3 years, 6 months ago by djwakelee.
• This reply was modified 3 years, 6 months ago by djwakelee.

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